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Justin Brady: I’m Justin Brady, and this is the Iowa business. Podcast in the Jethro’s Barbecue Studio. of course, love Jethro’s. Go to Iowa podcast.com and click at that banner at the top. If you buy a hundred dollars gift card from them, they’ll give you a $30. gift card. But today today, have you you ag Tariffs there. There’s so much stuff. Every week there’s something else, for business leaders here to adjust to. every week, and it’s chaotic. It’s all over the, place. so today, helping us break down what business owners care about what’s the impact? of ai? What’s the impact? of Agricultural changes, what’s the impact of logistics and supply chain, basically, we’re gonna ask him everything. Joe Murphy, the president of the Iowa business. Council, joins us Today, thank you so much for coming in the studio to break all these important issues

Joe Murphy: Glad to be here. Thanks for having me.

Justin Brady: man is gonna be a wild year. Um, but before we get into that, special thanks to Dentons Davis Brown. We had Beth Koonin in here who broke down another issue about talent retention in Iowa and how to keep talent. She is one of those people, one of those lawyers, That sees some of the challenges before they happen. She’s In those rooms and she’s like, Hey look, here’s what’s coming down the pipe. You know, if people are getting upset. Here’s how you keep talent. Here’s how you avoid those problems. Really good interview. Go to Iowa podcast.com/business to check that out. Joe. We met before um, when we were getting ready to launch, this show, right? Because I was doing a listening tour and I was like, look, what do business owners, what do executives in this country? ’cause you represent 21 of Iowa’s biggest executives, right? They’re all in this business council. So I was like, what Do people actually care about There’s a big difference between what the news covers and what information trends on social media And what these CEOs and executives actually care about? There’s a chasm there. Sure. And so I was doing this listening tour that’s where I met you, but one of the things you said that stuck out, which I think is a good launching point for this, is I don’t think a lot of business leaders in the state fully understand that ag and agriculture actually Do drive. a huge part of the Iowa economy.

Joe Murphy: without question. You know, when you think about our, our, our economy in the state of Iowa manufacturing is our largest, uh, growth state product percentage. But you think of all of the manufacturing that’s tied to agriculture. Agriculture is certainly the linchpin of Iowa’s economy, and we probably have three major economic industries in the state. Agriculture, manufacturing, financial services, biosciences. All linked to agriculture, right? And so if, if the ag economy is down, the concern that I think business leaders have all across the state is how will that impact some of these other aspects of Iowa’s economy? And what we’re beginning to see is that it’s starting to have, have an impact, starting to have an effect. And, and that’s concerning for us from a long-term perspective because I think one of the things that business leaders, no matter. You know, small business, medium sized business, you know, large business like an Iowa Business council member, they covet long-term sustainability and long-term certainty. And when a certain aspect of our economy, um, when you don’t have certainty in that, in that area, that creates problems.

Justin Brady: what is, you mentioned that stuff. um, that, you know, these things we’ve discussed are starting to have the long-term impact. Now we’re Starting to see the impact. What are some of the, and again, politics aside, right, what are some of the top offenders that are really playing an impact for better or for worse? Sure. Um, ’cause I understand there are a lot of debates to be had in. Uh, uh, like some of the MAHA stuff. and Pesticides and there are great debate there. There’s a great debate on the tariff stuff, uh, and there are positives and negatives to all this stuff. Those are issues we obviously dig into here and other shows, but What are some of the big offenders right now that are putting some downward pressure? on these Iowa leaders who represent, the biggest employers in our

Joe Murphy: I think the biggest thing, and it’s sort of a catchall in it that, I don’t mean to make this sound like a dodge of the question, but I think the overall aspect of it is just the lack of certainty, the uncertainty that we’re having. In the market right now. I think, um, maybe pinning down on one or two areas, it, it, it’s trade, um, it, it’s trade in the ag sector, how, how China is evolving with respect to the, the framework agreement that was announced earlier this fall. You know, we haven’t sold hardly any soybeans to China, um, this, uh, this past year. Normally they get about 60% of our beans grown in this state that has a spillover effect in a lot of other, in a lot of other aspects of our economy. So, so it comes down to uncertainty. Uncertainty relating to trade. Um, sort of the, the. Sort of the, the ways in which these tariffs and trade negotiations or deals are announced. You know, we’re gonna increase tariffs by a lot very quickly. Then they pulled back, then they get put back on. And so this sort of snap back and forth between tariffs on, tariffs off, tariffs on again, leads to a, a sense of, not anxiety, but I think just a sense of, you know, uncertainty. And if we were able, if business leaders were able to have more clarity. On those policy prescriptions, they would be better, they would be in a better position to outlay their capital, outlay their hiring practices, think about strategic investments in their, in their companies and communities. And with an absence of that certainty, they’re not able to move forward as quickly as they probably would like to given the circumstances on the ground.

Justin Brady: Yeah. And is this mostly like state volatility or federal volatility? It sounds like you’re saying federal volatility. federal, federal

Joe Murphy: federal volatility, for sure. Yeah. Yeah.

Justin Brady: And like, you know whether, Right. uh, you know, lawmakers, Whether right or wrong, they have their own strategies and they don’t wanna show their hand to other countries and Trade wars and you know, what their overall plans are. Okay, I

Joe Murphy: course, sure.

Justin Brady: Sure. But at the same time, when you don’t communicate and when you don’t explain, to people, look, here’s the, long-term strategy, here’s what we’re working on. They have every right to panic and they have every right to be very, very. concerned over what future action, what Future things are gonna happen to their

Joe Murphy: Right. And I think that’s a really important point. You know, we, we understand, I think business leaders understand the goals of the tariff policies that this administration is, is putting forward. And, and the goals are laudable. Right. You know, address the trade. Uh. Imbalance. You know, make sure company, or I’m sorry, countries are playing by the right rules, right? Let’s make sure that we’re benefiting American companies, American employers, and American employees most importantly. Um, but I think, you know, I wouldn’t say panic, but I, I think we’re, it just as these policies play out, it’s taking more time than I think we ever thought. And I think it’s, it’s one of those things where, you know, if we could just get some resolution on these things. We would be in a much better position to address, address a whole host of other things that, that companies are, are ready to go. And I think the longer this goes on, the more uncertainty there is. And again, as I mentioned there, you will see almost like a freezing effect on, you know, capital investment. You’ll see a freezing effect on, on hiring, um, which we’re already sort of seeing right now according to our survey work. Um, and, and that’s obviously something that, that we want to get past. Right. Um, and, and hopefully that comes sooner than later.

Justin Brady: Yeah. Because the. uh, larger, obviously Small, medium sized businesses here in Iowa, um, may operate or have a little bit more nim, They’re a little bit more nimble sure. Than maybe a larger organization. And these, these CEOs that you just, you talk with all the time or, or these, these CEOs that are in the council, but a larger organization that has. Hundreds of thousands of mouths to feed They represent all these workers and all these people, they need more. Um. They need more communication. ’cause They plan out, yeah, 10, they have these 10 year plans. Sure. Right. Like a small, I I think a small, medium sized business that absolutely does rely on. These larger companies, services, contracts, whatever. they may be a little bit more nimble and they’re like, well, you can just adapt guys. But you’re saying, Hmm. when you, when you have these very, very large companies that represent I most of Iowa’s, GDP, They can’t just adapt on a dime. Right. They need a lot of runway to make. these changes, which is why this very quick moving environment, Which may have, its ups, may have its good things and bad things, but this is why the members of the council are like, we’re just gonna wait. Basically. Is that kind of where they’re at? They’re like, we’re gonna stabilize, we’re just gonna wait. We’re not going to invest here. We’re not going to divest. We’re just gonna wait and see what

Joe Murphy: That’s exactly right. And, and I think that’s a, it’s a very astute point that you make because we have the ability, the largest companies in the state mostly have the ability because there’s such behemoths, right? To kind of wait some of these things out. We would of course, like, like to have, uh, these. These issues sort of resolved as quickly as possible, but, but we have the capacity, we have some of the bandwidth, we certainly have the balance sheets to enable us to, you know, weather these storms probably more efficiently than some of the smaller companies around the state. And so it, it hits the smaller companies, I think, a little bit differently. Right. They’re, they’re, while they’re, they’re quick to adjust in some capacities because they, they’re not such the large aircraft carrier that you have to turn in the middle of the ocean, right?

Justin Brady: actually. Yeah.

Joe Murphy: but but their profit margins are probably smaller. They, they don’t have the flexibility with their sourcing, right?

Justin Brady: Mm-hmm.

Joe Murphy: have the flexibility with their employees. And so, um. It hits them a little bit differently. No, no. You know, and, and in some ways, you know, probably a little bit worse, right? Because they don’t have, they don’t have the runway to kind of wait these things out, uh, in, in a, in a way that probably some of the larger companies do. And so, you know, these policy impacts, uh, have. Have an, have an effect on all Iowa companies. They all have an impact in, in different ways, and I think that cumulative effect is something that, that we’re mindful of when we talk about the economy, trying to figure out solutions, trying to make sure that we’re taking, I think the most important thing is that we take a long-term view of the situation. We don’t make rash decisions because those, the, the circumstances on the policy field could change the very next day, very next hour. Right? And so that’s, that’s an important thing to keep in mind, hard to do in the moment. Totally recognize that, but I think that’s what’s really important for Iowa companies to, to take away, is to take that long-term view, don’t make rash decisions and, and keep moving forward the best that you can.

Justin Brady: You mentioned How Iowans and Iowa executive leadership. I’ve been doing actually a lot of crazy research on this, but Iowans in general, uh, are very calculated.

Joe Murphy: Mm-hmm.

Justin Brady: They don’t make quick decisions. Uh, some type people call that risk aversion. Some people call, say, Iowans are very slow, But historically. through periods of ups and Downs. Iowa’s usually tried and true. Yeah. Where some states are just having absolute economic carve outs and destruction. Iowa feels a little bit of a bump, but it’s never chaotic here. Totally.

Joe Murphy: Totally agree.

Justin Brady: Historically, that’s worked great. Yeah. But how does, that play into the fast paced world we live in now, which is ai, Like AI is here and even in my wildest dreams, it has progressed way faster than any of us thought. So are we seeing the Iowa Business Council executives kind of push it off and say, we’re gonna wait on that? Or Are they saying, uh, we are absolutely jumping? into this Technology. now? Like What are, what’s the actual perspective?

Joe Murphy: So I think, you know, you talk about being, uh, uh, you know, slow to adapt or, you know, I forget the fir the criticism. Yeah, yeah. The criticisms. We would say strategic, right? We would say we would stay, we would want to take a strategic outlook of, of the situation. AI is a great example. It’s hard to believe, uh, that, that we’re like. A thousand days into this revolution in some respects, right? Because chat PT came out like sort of to the masses Uhhuh right? Yeah. Like two and a half, three, you know, almost three years ago. So like a thousand days basically. Uh, which is sort of mind blowing. Um, so I think, I think companies, Iowa business council companies. Uh, I don’t wanna say they’re, they’re all in on the technology, but they’re, but they’re obviously all using it to better their products, better their innovations, and some, some companies are farther ahead than others. I think a lot of business leaders from our members are, are thinking about ways in which. They can use the tool to their long-term advantage, increase productivity, increase innovations, as I mentioned, increase product lines, free up people’s time from menial tasks so that they can dedicate more of their, of their brain power towards those things that will, that will make a huge difference, right, for the company and for themselves and get more out of their job. Quite frankly, no one likes to enter all sorts of, you know, data entry or research, you know, menial things. Right? And so I think the question that, that we’re now exploring is how do you teach our, our employees the benefits of this tool? Because I think there’s a lot of. Anxiety around, you know, oh my gosh, AI’s gonna replace all of these people. And, and, and we don’t buy into that. We think it’s, you know, it’s gonna be, it’s gonna be a tool that’s gonna benefit every single individual. But I think the critical piece here that’s so important. Is that you have to learn how to use the tool. And so AI is not going to replace you, but you might be replaced by somebody who knows more about ai, particularly if you just put your hands up and say, you know what? I’m out. I’m not gonna, I’m not gonna embrace the technology. Um, and so I’m not saying, and I don’t think our members would ever say that you have to go all in and just refocus your entire life around ai, but you better learn. How to use it. And so the important thing here is that our members are beginning to think about ways in which they can retrain their employees, right? If you’re a mid-career person, I’m 42, right? So mid-career type of individual, you know, I didn’t really know what AI was before, you know, a year and a half, two years ago. What can the companies do to, to give you, to give you, as an employee the tools to, to reshore your skills in this area? Hey, what’s step one? What’s step zero? How can you use this in your everyday work life that will make you a better employee, a better production person so that you’re, you know, insulated from the changes, but then also feel comfortable with, with using it as a tool. And that’s, that’s what’s exciting about, you know, the, the new entrance into the workforce. The fact that, you know, they’re somewhat. AI native. Right. If that’s even a thing yet. Sure. They’re, they’ve been using it probably more than you and I have been. Maybe not, maybe not you, but you know, certainly, certainly me. Um, and I think that’s what’s really exciting and, and you’ll see some, some really interesting things I think come up and out of this.

Justin Brady: see, So in the, in the closed door meetings and In these, are there realistically discussions of. of Other, other businesses? are using it to replace jobs or That’s what they’re doing. We know we don’t wanna say that out loud, but other businesses are absolutely doing that, and we have to debate, are we gonna do that too? Are we gonna cut the workforce and let AI’s work for us? Is it that conversation? or is it the conversation I see the slight head nod there? Or is it the conversation where it’s like, we actually do think this will, superpower our current employees. we think this will make them. more productive. We think this will bring in a heck of a lot more profit and we’ll Probably use the profit to hire more critical thinkers. Is this Which conversation is actually, happening? yeah,

Joe Murphy: I I think it’s the, the last point that that you made. ’cause look, I think at the end of the day, you know, set AI aside, we still find ourselves in a workforce crunch. You know, one of the, the perennial top three issues that our, that our companies, you know, talk about when we survey our members each quarter is the ability to attract and at attain, uh, a workforce in Iowa. Right? And so. No one is really talking about using AI to replace jobs at all. In fact, they’re talking about AI to, to supplement jobs, right? Like, how can we, how can we, you know, offload some of the strain and stress of some of these jobs, um, to make people freed up and, and to pursue other things within the company that they, that they might wanna pursue. I think. The, the thing that we have to keep in mind though is given our workforce challenges, given our broader population challenges in our state, companies will certainly use technology as a way to supplement their workforce. Mm-hmm. You know, so if they, if they can’t find a person in a specific field, they will always turn to technology as a way to, you know, shore that up or to supplement their existing workforce. We see it manufacturing. White collar jobs, other types of jobs. Right. But, but we’re not seeing, you know, a huge replacement o of of people yet. And I think, you know, nationally when companies have done that, you know, I think about some of the customer service jobs and some of these chat bots that, that companies have experimented with, it hasn’t really gone well.

Justin Brady: Mm-hmm.

Joe Murphy: You know, and so you still need people to, you know, troubleshoot and work and deal with all of these things. So we’re optimistic that it’s gonna gonna create more jobs, going to create more opportunity for investment in employers, uh, I’m sorry, employees and, and, uh, and the broader, uh, companies.

Justin Brady: will say, I think one of the, areas that may, and you can disagree with this, that’s fine. This is my own personal opinion, everybody, but one of the jobs that, may disrupt is offshoring jobs. like I do see some very low skill offshoring jobs in, in Other countries We offshore barely any training there, uh, individuals I speak with. that don’t speak English when I’m calling a customer service number And in some cases, like, dude, I’d rather just speak to an AI and get this thing done right? And so I do wonder If there is a future where we actually, you know, let’s say the scenario, I’ll make this short, but let’s say the scenario is, uh, company A has 2000 customer service representatives all off shored. Zero domestically, and they use AI to superpower. 200 people, Domestically. So we’re bringing the net gain of jobs domestically is higher. The overall net, the overall, uh, loss of jobs globally for certain companies. is maybe lower, But I, I do see, maybe that playing out. I don’t know the answer, but I don’t, and this is my own bias. I cannot see as someone who digs into this a lot, I just cannot see the future. Where AI adoption in this country results in a net job loss. I don’t see that, And I’ve, I’ve had this conversation so many times and I can’t see how that happens. right. The a the, you mentioned the population uh, concerns in Iowa. I know that We’ve talked about this a lot. This show’s very young. We’ve already talked about it quite a bit, is this is a huge. huge concern and it’s becoming a problem. Now we, the baby. boomerang thing’s not really happening as much as it used to. Those numbers are decreasing, and as you correctly point out in some of the areas that people are concerned about job disruption, we already have critical shortages, right? So it’s like, what jobs are we disrupting? These are Empty jobs, We, The only solution we have is to superpower the current employees we have Right. Hopefully with ai, right. So that we can actually get this stuff done. Sure. So are our, leaders. actually getting the staffing they need right now or are they already underwater? and facing shortages?

Joe Murphy: I think it’s a little bit of both, right? I think there’s, there’s shortages all across, uh, the, the employment sector right now. I mean, we need, we need people in all, all different types of occupations, whether it’s service positions at our restaurants and hotels across the state, or, you know. Plant pathologists at, at Corteva agriscience in, in, uh, in Johnston. We need people right in this state. We need to continue to grow our population. There was some census data that was released, uh, just a few weeks ago, uh, I think at the end of January that showed that, that Iowa grew at at 0.2%, uh, over, over the last, over the last year, one of the, one of the lower. Of, uh, population growth in the, in the Midwest, second only to, to Illinois. So, you know, the good news we’re growing. Mm-hmm. Right? There are other states that are losing population, right. Or, and that are shrinking. Um, but this has been an issue that we have faced as a state for a long

Justin Brady: decades. Correct.

Joe Murphy: what’s new about it is, I think, you know, with the Iowa Business Council and our members have done a really good job over the last six or seven years, is just highlighting this. And, you know, this doesn’t, this is not a partisan issue, but you know, if you think about a healthy company as a growing company, a healthy state is a growing state. Uh, and we need to grow. And, you know, when we think about opportunities to grow in our state, it’s retaining our, our highly educated, uh, individuals. You know, post high school graduation, post community college, or post four year institution graduation, right? So, so minimize the brain drain. Um, but then also continuing to be, uh, a welcoming place of hope and opportunity for our, for our, our, our legal immigrants that are coming in. To this, to this state, we would’ve lost population had it not been for legal immigration coming in into Iowa. And we have a rich legacy and history of, of being a welcoming, uh, state for people, whether it was the Bosnians, um, in, in the nineties, whether it was, uh, people from Southeast Asia post Vietnam, uh, in the 1970s. We should lean into that. And I, and I think, we’ll, we can, uh, we can weather some of the, these population storms. Well, we just have to be, make a dedicated effort to that and get some help, uh, in Washington DC

Justin Brady: Yeah. I’m, I’m I appreciate the clarity there. I, when, whenever it comes to just political when we’re, whenever we’re talking about immigrants, everyone lumps everything together. Legal and illegal. and the whole, No one wants to, it it, it basically adds to confusion. Totally. And it drives me. absolutely insane Because you can’t debate an issue properly if you don’t, just bring clarity to It drives me crazy. Um, let’s briefly touch on the

Joe Murphy: Sure.

Justin Brady: Um, whether good or bad Are they have, you mentioned earlier, 60% of soybeans I believe were sent to China, Of course, that’s not happening anymore. Or At least it’s greatly reduced At this point. And I know that one of our, biggest threats there is Brazil because they grow a lot of soybeans. So, Um, that’s one example, but. Are the tariffs starting to have a lot of pressure on Iowa manufacturing and Iowa agriculture? Is this starting to really, affect the bottom line here and push its way down to employees and, and, and executives as they make

Joe Murphy: Yeah, I think, I think we still need to see some of the data on that, you know, to make a conclusion. But I, but I think, I think it’s, I think it’s a little bit. Early. However, um, what we’re seeing in the, in the preliminary data sets is that it’s act absolutely having, having an effect, right? I mean, I think the fact that you’re seeing, um, costs being increased, uh, at the, at the company level, um, is certainly the case. Right. Uh, input costs are, are higher than they ever have been. Um, you mentioned, you mentioned the agricultural sector on, on tariffs. It’s sort of a double whammy. There. We’re not able to gain access to the markets ’cause of the tariffs that. That we’ve put on those countries, and then we’re also getting retaliatory tariffs put on us. And so not only can we not sell our product over there, but we’re also having to deal with tariffs on the inputs that we put into the ground and other aspects of our, of our ag economy. So our input costs have never been higher, right? In some, in some respects. So we’re kind of getting hit from, from both ends there. From a business or manufacturing standpoint. Same situation. There’s high tariffs on, on steel, there’s high tariffs on, you know, wood products, construction products. And so as we can try, continue to try to make products literally here in Iowa from a manufacturing standpoint, um, we’re seeing tariffs definitely have an impact on, on our businesses. What, what we’re seeing right now is that a lot of businesses are, are trying their best to absorb their costs because we’re sort of in this very, uh. I think delicate situation from a consumer perspective where consumers are very price sensitive currently and. I think manufacturers and companies are reticent to increase prices on consumers because they don’t want to then lower the demand even more. But you can only absorb those cost increases internally for so long before you have to have some sort of release valve into the system. And so when, when will that occur? Um, we’re seeing some of that happening already, excuse me, but. But I think, you know my point earlier about too early to tell. That’s really what I’m, what I’m getting at. Where, where does that, uh, valve kind of open up on the, on the price increases to the consumer? We’re already seeing it on the business end right now with input costs. When do those get into the consumer market, I think is the ultimate

Justin Brady: So basically to investors. expect to see maybe a little bit of, uh, pro, a little bit of profit loss. not ne necessary loss. but definitely profit. The slowing of profit for Q1 and Q2.

Joe Murphy: Squeeze margins. Yeah.

Justin Brady: And realize that this is the reason, it’s happening. It’s not that the companies have some significant challenge or issue or problem or internal problems. The reason it’s happening is because these tariffs like are finally starting to catch up. People have cut, they’ve reduced, they’ve been efficient. And eventually that’s going to show in the balance sheet.

Joe Murphy: Absolutely.

Justin Brady: Yeah. Okay. Um, are, are people speaking of the tariffs here in Iowa are people successfully finding. Domestic replacements for some stuff in like united within the United States, and if so, what are the, like, what does that look like?

Joe Murphy: Yeah. You know, admittedly, you know, I, we’ve not really looked at that yet, so the answer could be yes, right? But, but I think. From, from our perspective, you know, we source things from our members source things from outside of the country when they can’t find things right here, you know, locally, right. Or, or in America. Right? But that, but, but it’s expensive to source things internationally. Your supply chains become much longer, you know, the import costs in general. But then when you tack on a 10 to 15 to 20% tariff, on top of that, it gets even more expensive. So, you know. Companies are very good at, you know, finding optimizations within their spreadsheets and within their budgets. And so when they decide to import something, it, that’s the best business case for them, uh, oftentimes. And so. You know, I, I don’t know if we’re going to see, we’re not gonna all of a sudden start growing avocados here, right? Dang

Justin Brady: Dang

Joe Murphy: it in, in Iowa. As great as that would be. That would

Justin Brady: That would be

Joe Murphy: Um, you know, I don’t, I don’t think we’re going to, to see that, that’s an extreme example, you know, sort of tongue in cheek, but. But I don’t, we’ve not seen that yet. Um, but, you know, but, but companies will always be savvy enough to find, um, pockets where they can, you know, contain costs or resource things or, you know, apply for waivers or exemptions or what have you.

Justin Brady: Well, this goes back to what we were talking about earlier. which is supply Big battleships take a long time. to turn. Yep. Supply chains are. global, whether you Like it or not, this is a global economy and there are some materials, critical minerals, whatever that are only found in other countries or only developed in other countries. And So Because a lot of businesses, are the sit and wait. we don’t know the long-term implications. We don’t know if the tariffs are gonna be lifted next week. Right. That that’s why they’re probably not. That’s probably why you haven’t heard Of any major domestic, replacements, because why would we completely upend the entire supply chain We’ve built over years for something that could change next week. People Just don’t

Joe Murphy: Yeah. And I, and I think it gets back to the first point earlier on is, is that, you know, having, uh, seeking certainty in these scenarios, I think is what’s so critically important. So people can make decisions in the best interests of their company, their shareholders, and their employees.

Justin Brady: And that’s what I would like. To see from the white, House and from Congress is, um, just give us some clarity, give us a runway. You know, um, I, I have heard both sides of the decisions that are being made in pros and cons. I’m like, okay, I get it, but gosh, you need to communicate. Kind of give us something. The, I think probably the last question here is energy. Yeah. Uh, nationally energy is a big concern. The United States is kind of getting behind overall, not Iowa. Iowa is, at least far as energy. We have a lot of it. It’s very, cheap. but we also have data centers being built at a record level here and AI that’s gonna be running in these data centers consumes a lot. right? A lot of energy. So is this something that your members are concerned about. Thinking, Hey, Right now it’s great. Energy’s cheap. everything’s fine. But we see where the future is going. We see the data centers popping up. We see that, uh, AI likes to gobble energy. And we’re concerned What that looks like in the future, Is this a concern that’s being discussed and prepared for,

Joe Murphy: I don’t know if it’s necessarily. A concern that’s like an existential crisis type of thing. I think, you know, energy consumption over the years has always gone up. It’s just sort of on an upward trajectory, more so than we’ve seen, right. As we talked about with, with AI usage. So, you know, I think Iowa’s really positioned well given our sort of foundation within our utility structure already in this state. Um, you know, I think that there’s a lot of. Good work to be done with our, all of the above approach, right? In Iowa, whether it’s renewable, whether it’s nuclear, whether it’s, you know, traditional fossil fuels. Having that blend I think will really be helpful for us in, in Iowa. Um, I think, I think additionally from a federal perspective, we’re really optimistic about some, some permitting reform that, that could occur, um, in Washington DC this, this coming year that will help. Pardon the pun. Energize our thank you, our, uh, our systems in, in, in Iowa, but in, in the country as well to help, to help control the costs and to help, uh, maybe fast track some of these construction projects that, that, you know, take some time, right?

Justin Brady: Like what? What, which construction? projects,

Joe Murphy: Well, any, any construction project, particularly with, with renewable wind or, or other renewable projects, you know, there’s a permitting process that you have to go into and there’s environmental assessments and then one administration could come in and then say, you know what? Automatically permits pulled, but the company’s already invested. You know, billions of dollars of capital, getting a handle on that. So companies can, again, plan, operate with some certainty. And move forward in a, in a positive direction. So, you know, I understand that, uh, and I think our, our members understand that, you know, energy consumption will continue to increase. I just think we have to be, um, thoughtful in, in how we address that, that consumption. But I think Iowa’s in a, in a really good place, probably better than most states, uh, given our, our, uh, utility structure in Iowa to, to navigate that

Justin Brady: Yeah, You bring up a good. point that I don’t think I’ve ever thought of, which is the diversification of energy that we have. we’re in a bizarre spot, great spot where we can reuse renewables. We have access to coal, We have access to. fuel ethanol, We have access to to wind. And then I think there’s a new plant being built. Is it the eastern part of Iowa? A nuclear

Joe Murphy: Yeah. So Dwayne Arnold Energy, um, was nuclear at one point. And then I think decommissioned. Decommissioned. And then I think there’s an effort now to bring that back on. You’ll have to fact check me on that, but I think, but, but that’s the plan. I, I, as I understand it. So again, you know, all the above approach I think just helps. To your point, diversify that. That pipeline. Um, and that will lead to, you know, good things for Iowa companies and consumers.

Justin Brady: Okay. Real last question. What, are there any major things that are keeping your members up at night? Like the things that just are constant, concern that maybe they are not the, be they don’t communicate it that well, The organization is like, you know, it’s not our place to cau talk about these things. It’s Our place to, you know, bring value for shareholders or keep Our employees. are, are there any patterns you’re seeing that are keeping them up? at night that Iowans need to be aware of? So.

Joe Murphy: So I, again, I would say that, you know, in our surveys show this out, that, that we remain very optimistic in the future economic health of, of Iowa, right. Our survey scores are well above our critical threshold to, to. Enumerate

Justin Brady: Mm.

Joe Murphy: Um, but I, I do think, again, going back to the population conversation, that’s one thing that we continue to, um, find a need to highlight and, and talk about, right? The fact that, you know, hey, look, we are growing, but we’re not growing as much as we should. If you think about the long-term economic opportunity in this state, it’s all tied back to people. Regardless of ai, regardless of anything else. So what can we do to make Iowa the most attractive place to live, work, raise a family, have a career, all of those things, and let’s put into place practices, policies and other, other areas of, of opportunity to to ensure that we’re growing our population, growing our talent pipeline, and creating opportunities for future economic success for Iowans. Yeah.

Justin Brady: Yeah, we had Rick Tollson in here on the Iowa Podcast, which is another one of our shows, and he was mentioning like the icon, water trails, and bike, And he’s like, yeah, people like to look at this stuff. And they’re like, oh, that’s a nice to have. You know, why are we wasting time? on this? He’s like, We’re wasting time on this for those listening air quotes, Because that brings people here. And we don’t grow if we don’t have People. And so these, nice to have things. Um, and that’s why we’re see businesses chipping in and donating to these things,

Joe Murphy: in huge, ways. Not just on, on those things, but whether it’s housing projects, uh, h housing projects in, in communities or, you know, childcare facilities. Right. Businesses are, are really looking at ways in which they can allocate their capital in ways that are going to increase. Population based in their communities. But your point on the quality of life, hugely important, right? The data shows that people moving into a community look first now at what. There are things to, like, what things can I do in that, in that community after I, you know, clock out of work? So, and that’s new, right? That’s new. Um, it used to be like, well, what’s my good job? What, where can I live now? It’s, well, what do I do on the weekends or my free time? So it’s important to be investing in those things and, and Rick’s doing an awesome job with Icon and so many other things around the

Justin Brady: Great job. And of course, he deserves his retirement That is Finally here, Joe Murphy, the president of. the Iowa Business Council, you are such a fricking Wealth of

Joe Murphy: information. Thank you so

Justin Brady: much for coming on. the

Joe Murphy: for having me. You bet.